Resident Evil 7 vs Edge of Nowhere (spoilers)

[Zenbane]

Warning: this discussion may be awkward

First off, while I did beat Edge of Nowhere over the course of 2 days (about 6 hours of gaming total), I have not yet played RE7. I would like to experience it in VR, however, I am perfectly content watching other people play it on YouTube. In fact, I watched the entire playthrough via PewDiePie.

See... awkward. 😘

So if you're still reading, here is my dilemma:

When Edge of Nowhere first came out, there was a ton of excitement by what seems to be a "smaller VR fanbase." While over on the larger end, folks began complaining incessantly about the 3rd person camera. After about a week or two, people shifted their complaints to the storyline. Apparently it was too "predictable."

And then there is Resident Evil 7 which is getting large amounts of praise. Yet the puzzles are very standard (nothing compared to Myst, Riven, Legend of Grimrock, Longest Journey, etc); and the boss battles are surprisingly cookie-cutter console style experiences. At the highlight of one huge boss battle, PieDiePie says, "The Legend of Zelda called, they want their boss back." Later the game further unfolds to become a game sequence that very heavily borrows from FEAR.

But that's not what prompted me to share my thoughts here. No, what I found interesting are the direct parallels with the storyline that both RE7 and Edge of Nowhere share:

1) The main character is a male.
2) The main character is looking for his lost woman.
3) The women in both games turn out to be monsters.
4) There are time jumps and memories.
5) There is supernatural shit happening.
6) Both games involve enemies trying to indoctrinate the character; the "join us" theme.
7) Both games trick the main character in to believing he escaped.
😎 After that trickery, both games immediately place the main character on a boat.
9) Both games climax with a battle against a monster that is larger than life.
10) Both games end with the hero leaving the main site in an aerial vehicle.

The ship sequence really got me the most, because the parallels between the boat sequence in RE7 and the shipyard in Edge of Nowhere are greatly evident. As is the plot point in which these boats are introduced. It is also worth mentioning that on the RE7 ship you are playing a "memory" whereas in Edge of Nowhere you are playing a "dream."

Side note: is the gaming industry secretly trying to tell us that all boats are evil? hmm.

I should take this moment to make a few things clear as well. I am in no way trying to criticize RE7 nor argue that the praise it receives is unwarranted. I am also not arguing that Edge of Nowhere is a better game.

If anything, I am simply addressing what I refer to as "gamer amnesia." The gaming community will criticize one game for having very specific elements, but then praise another even though it has extremely similar (or close to identical) elements. And they will give such praise as long as the newer game implements "shinier objects" and meets specific expectations - even if those expectations do nothing for the game itself.

For example, the key difference between these games is that RE7 is in first-person view, and Edge of Nowhere is 3rd person. This difference in an action-based game with puzzle solving elements is minor, imo.

As far as I can tell, that camera difference is the single deciding factor that drives peoples opinions. Since gamers truly demand a first-person perspective (especially in VR), then any game that deviates is open to criticism on multiple fronts. Simply put: if Edge of Nowhere had implemented a first-person camera then all that stuff I read regarding "predictability" and "unfulfilling storyline" may never have surfaced. Just as they have not surfaced with RE7 despite the fact that it shares those exact same storyline elements.

In closing, the message I am getting from everyone is as follows,

The gaming industry is trying to tell people to stay the hell away from boats. The gamer community is trying to tell the industry to make everything first-person view or even your storyline sucks.

FIN.

😄

[Zenbane]

I wouldn't mind the option to go back and forth between camera views.

When I played the MMORPG, Dark Age of Camelot, I had the ability to switch from 3rd to 1st person. And my usage was pretty standard:

1) First Person View for all PvP battles.
2) Third Person View for all PvE experiences.

I loved being in 3rd view during a quest or raid, because I was able to see so much more of the environment, enemies, and other party members. But of course when it came to realm warfare and killing enemy players... only first person view would do.

In VR I never minded the 3rd person perspective because it allowed me to see so much more. And personally that it was I love most about gaming: the artistic achievements of the software environment. But I understand that other people would prefer first person for VR, and I think they should get it. The option for multiple camera angles should be standard, just like the option for movement (free-roam vs teleport).

At the end of the day, more options make the world a better place.

With me and First Person view in VR... the only way I can take everything in, visually, is by constantly looking around with my head like some kinda nervous creature:

[cybereality]

So, I've played both games. I liked both very much. Resident Evil is just a much fuller game, both in the length (probably around twice as long or more) and also the depth of content, variety of environments, quality of the models, and just overall higher production values.

But, the biggest thing for me was the first person perspective. First person is just more immersive, you feel like you are there. I love 3rd person for 2D games (or even 3D games on a monitor with glasses) but VR really begs for first person for the most immersive experience.

However, some games work better in one perspective or the other (for example, I couldn't really imagine Lucky's Tale working first person) so there is room for both. Especially when you consider comfort and the limitations of current VR systems and the human body. A first person shooter with the speed of something like Left4Dead is just not feasible with today's technology. In third person you have a little more room with the controls. For example, the character can jump without nasty forced camera movement, or you can keep the camera moving slowly (like Edge of Nowhere) or stationary (like Chronos).

At the same time, head-tracking in a 3rd person game is sort of artificial and not nearly as useful as with first person, so it ends up feeling like the game isn't really virtual reality but simply using the headset as a fancy 3D monitor. Maybe that is OK for some games, but it certainly isn't what I've been imagining since the 90's as what virtual reality is supposed to be. But there is room in the market for developers to experiment and what works best and what is popular will eventually play out.

[chtan]

I have finished Edge of Nowhere only 1 time. Love the game and it's setting and environment. But once you get the shot gun, everything become very easy and not that scary any more. Still there are plenty of surprise there.
I beaten RE7 in easy, normal and madhouse. Initial play thru. is very tense and full of surprise as well. The more scary part is the start session where you are in the mansion with and undead monster at your tail. The setting is very dark and scary, the pacing is a bit slower.
If only RE7 is in VR, it would be much more scarier than Edge of Nowhere. It can easily stresses your tension and anxiety to the max.
I thought at the end the main character died in EOW when the airplane was consumed by the big bad octopus like creature, no?

[Zenbane]

chtan said:

I thought at the end the main character died in EOW when the airplane was consumed by the big bad octopus like creature, no?

Yes that's correct. Even though both characters fly off (airplane vs helicopter), the main character dies in Edge but the main character lives in RE7.

@cybereality great post. I would say that there were parts of Edge where immersion was unmistakable. For me it was during some of the extreme heights situations, and when facing off against the huge beast.

[Anonymous]

I wonder if it is a "LOT" of extra work for a AAA title like this to have a VR option..I mean, if it is not, why not have AAA games have a VR option too? I've read about why there will be a shortage of AAA titles in VR because customers are limited.. But having AAA titles like RE7 which have both VR and normal modes wont have that kind of problems imho

[Shadowmask72]

Interesting topic. Not sure why you went with Pew to watch this over a walkthrough that has no commentary so you get a better feel of the atmospherics without the Youtuber drama, hyperbole and comedic comments - whatever floats yer boat though.

However, as already mentioned. The key factor for Resident Evil 7 VR's success is the first person viewpoint. You simply can't beat that for a VR game.  Third person views which are proven to work well in VR as we've seen in several games now, doesn't put you into the character, you're merely an observer whilst still appreciating the sense of scale.

For me, what I loved about RE 7 in VR was the fact I was made to feel genuinely uneasy moving into dark unknown areas - you are in the game, everything happens to you. I don't believe these feelings can be conveyed when you're looking at a character in Third Person who isn't you and never will be. This fact alone is difference enough to sway opinion and as you say make people favour one similar experience over another.  Shortcomings and all. As for RE 7 locations I saw the ship section (which isn't all retrospective btw) as a homage to Resident Evil Revelations which also contains an abandoned ship.  I felt whilst playing RE7 that it was an amalgamation of ideas from previous games.

For the record though. I've not played Edge of Nowhere. 

[JaimieVandenber]

Nacaryus said:

I wonder if it is a "LOT" of extra work for a AAA title like this to have a VR option...

All developers are saying that a lot of extra planning and design needs to go into VR, yes.

Note that the VR headsets commercially arrived only 9 months ago, and AAA games releasing now would have been way past design stage and nearing completion by then - the AAA dev cycle is 2.5-4 years, roughly. Yes, some software houses will have been working with pre-release headsets (DK2 releases of Doom3, Alien Isolation etc), but AAA releases tend to be very business-centric and only concentrate of sure commercial things ("shoot man in head", generally).

Over the next year I'm expecting that we'll be seeing AAA releases that have had more chance to bake in VR design at the earlier stages. Looking forward to that!

[JaimieVandenber]

See the "Start Citizen VR On Hold" thread nearby for lots of chat about how hard it is to directly shoehorn VR into a game dev team that wasn't thinking about it and has now realised the quantity of stuff that they'd need to change...

[n3cr0-0]

chtan said:

I thought at the end the main character died in EOW when the airplane was consumed by the big bad octopus like creature, no?

Wait wait wait. Sorry but that octopus thing.... That had to be non other than Cthulhu right? The elder god? the destroyer of worlds? that big half dragon half human half octopus thing? that was the mother f'n Cthulhu right?

As soon as I seen Cthulhu I was shitting myself thinking ohhhhhhh f*** I'm dead.

 If that wasn't what devs were going for, well sorry but they got it. Another Lovecraft aftermath story line which I really loved (only played through 1 time... worth every penny)