Some new thoughts regarding "presence"

[flexy123]

I recently posted a theory that many of those games which seem "most impressive" in VR do so because they are playing in space, eg. with a black background. Games like ED etc. come to mind. My reasoning behind this theory (it it may be well totally far-fetched) was that the black background makes the somewhat limited FOV of a HMD headset less apparent.

Yesterday I had some more thoughts about why some games seem more immersive, "real" and you feel like you're really being there..like "WHOA!!" and while others don't.

For example, there were some of these free VR experiences on "VAPOR", where you did virtual travel to several parts of the world. Including an English old Castle, Germany etc. While for a moment these experiences were "nice", they were quickly forgotten right after looking at them. Why is that? Why was I not totally blown away?

Then someone mentioned the "sub" demo from Dreamdeck, and as short and simple it is, it is still one of the experiences which I consider extremely impressive and I still don't know exactly why.

Some of the BEST experiences of "presence" and "really being there" for me had been flying with a really beefed up Prepar3D flight sim using FlyInside and then several experiences like the Apollo 11 VR experience and also this short game where you fly into space in a Mercury Capsule.

Now I did the math...sub demo from Dreamdeck...cockpits......and it dawned on me again that it's POSSIBLE that FOV plays a role there. Easy: If you're in a tiny space like a submarine, you don't perceive things across a wide FOV. You're literally crammed into a tiny space. And of course the same with cockpits, like the cockpit of a plane, space ship or inside the Apollo 11. And there we are again. I found WHY these experiences impressed me so much: Because VR can much better get across the feel of such scenarios where you are in a limited space....than it can "simulate" the reality of, say, being outside somewhere with a vast vista, say, with mountains around you etc. And this is why flying in FSX/P3D or being in a Mercury capsule feels more "real" in VR than, say, a virtual travel to some landscape.

Ya know I am just trying to understand why SOME experiences just stay in your memory and you are in awe (like the sub-demo where you really think you are there)...while others don't. Because logic would tell one it should be more impressive, say, if you are in VR somewhere in front of a big mountain range....but it seems that VR doesn't do as well there. Just speculating...

Edit: For me, the "best" and most "real" experience was really with the flight sim...the feeling of being IN the plane was so real I expected the backdoor opening and someone come in serving coffee to the pilots. Not kidding. Mind blowing.

[Hyomoto]

For me, Job Simulator stands out the best.  It isn't the graphics, it's the use of your hands that does it.  Because most things react appropriately and your hands let you interact very naturally with the world, it's easy for your brain to perceive the world around you despite you having no physical presence there.  It's obviously far from perfect but the touch controllers go a long way to drawing me into a scene.  I thought the Gear VR was very novel when I tried it, but even a game like Overkill CAN be impressive when you are hunkered down behind a concrete barrier and then realize, oh, I can peek out from ANY side of this thing.

That's where presence has best affected me.  The feeling of being in the scene and being able to virtually reach out and touch it.  Still, I really look forward to an expanded FOV and you are probably right.  Putting you in a helmet or something that logically restricts your view is probably a useful tool.  It's easy to forget the tunnel vision but it's still always there and quickly apparent with any eye movement.

[Vetkin]

FOV plays a huge role in immersion for me. The limited view makes it more apparent that I'm looking at a screen. I was actually more immersed with the DK1 than the CV1 despite the higher resolution.

[Roaster]

I find that sculpting in Medium is immersive in that you manipulate an object in space right there in front of you like it was very real.  As you work with it it's hard not to give it presence.
Cockpit environments and confined spaces give a better stereo depth perception due to distance. IRL distant objects have less stereo separation.

[flexy123]

Hyomoto said:

For me, Job Simulator stands out the best.  It isn't the graphics, it's the use of your hands that does it.  Because most things react appropriately and your hands let you interact very naturally with the world, it's easy for your brain to perceive the world around you despite you having no physical presence there.  It's obviously far from perfect but the touch controllers go a long way to drawing me into a scene.  I thought the Gear VR was very novel when I tried it, but even a game like Overkill CAN be impressive when you are hunkered down behind a concrete barrier and then realize, oh, I can peek out from ANY side of this thing.

That's where presence has best affected me.  The feeling of being in the scene and being able to virtually reach out and touch it.  Still, I really look forward to an expanded FOV and you are probably right.  Putting you in a helmet or something that logically restricts your view is probably a useful tool.  It's easy to forget the tunnel vision but it's still always there and quickly apparent with any eye movement.

You may be onto something there but I can only "pathetically agree" since I JUST ordered Touch and it will likely take a week until I get them. This also means I haven't experienced any "touch experiences" yet and so far avoided these games...UNTIL TODAY where I played "I Expect You To Die" for a little, although pathetically with my Xbox controller.

YET - the feeling of "being there" was extremely great since they did this VERY well being able to lift/manipulate things..like when you're sitting on this desk. I can only fathom this must be awesome x9000 with Touch when it's already so well done with the controller. You sit there on the desk and can interact with things, take them, lift them etc... I haven't seen Job Simulator yet...but yes I can *totally* see what you're saying there. The feeling to sit on this desk in some office was *extremely* real, I found myself wanting to put down my controller on the desk....it took me a sec to remember the desk is fricking VIRTUAL 🙂

[flexy123]

Vetkin said:

FOV plays a huge role in immersion for me. The limited view makes it more apparent that I'm looking at a screen. I was actually more immersed with the DK1 than the CV1 despite the higher resolution.

The funny thing is that the limited FOV doesn't actually bother me, subjectively speaking. But my observations why experiences in cockpits and in space are often so much "better" just lets me speculate that FOV plays a role, even if we're not realizing it.

[BrokenSymmetry]

Do you feel the world around you becomes less real when you are wearing a helmet which limits your FOV? I wouldn't think so. So FOV has zero effect on the perception. 

Some experiences are more impressive simply because we don't get to see them much in real life.

[Vetkin]

BrokenSymmetry said:

Do you feel the world around you becomes less real when you are wearing a helmet which limits your FOV? I wouldn't think so. So FOV has zero effect on the perception. 

Some experiences are more impressive simply because we don't get to see them much in real life.

If I was wearing a helmet that limited my fov and sight was the only one of my senses available, then I would be relying on a realism of the resolution for immersion.  Having at least partial peripheral vision helps a lot toward making me feel like I'm in a real space, especially at the resolution we have now.

In a cockpit environment the 3d effect is more apparent because of the small enclosure. So peripheral vision isn't quite as critical as it is when in an open environment.