What do you think of Roomscale?

[Anonymous]

Since the debate about roomscale is never ending, I would like to see what everyone thinks about it.

For newcomers, roomscale is a tracking feature that allows you to walk in a limited space (up to about 15x15ft) with tracked controllers, all working 1:1 in VR. At the moment the HTC Vive currently is the only HMD that does roomscale and does it very well, with Rift expecting to do a smaller roomscale with their Touch controllers in Fall 2016, though Rift is focusing on the user only moving around 180 degs with Touch, not full 360 like the Vive can do, Rift will also have a shorter cable, but can be extended.  

So what do you think about Roomscale?

[brantlew]

tranceology3 said:

For newcomers, roomscale is a tracking feature that allows you to walk in a limited space (up to about 15x15ft) with tracked controllers, all working 1:1 in VR.

This to me causes much confusion.  Why does the term "room-scale" include tracked controllers?  The term itself would only seem to imply some sort of size parameter, so why do the controllers get thrown into the mix to create a categorically different thing than a tracked headset in the same volume?  If you set the controllers down and move around, are you then not engaging in a room-scale experience?  What if you had body tracking - feet, torso, or even articulated hands?  Would that be room-scale or are controllers a requirement of the room-scale definition?  Why is it arbitrarily limited to 15x15 ft?  And if the maximum is 15x15, then what is the minimal size where it would stop being room-scale?  Is 360 degrees within a 1x1 m area plus tracked controllers considered room scale?  I know I'm being pedantic, but it just seems like "room-scale" is being put forth as a broad categorization and superset, while in practice it is describing a very specific feature set and fails to incorporate the nuances of other systems.  What about a CAVE?  What about body tracking?  What about unidirectional systems?  I'm not sure whether it's just poorly defined or poorly named?

[Anonymous]

@brantlew I think because VR is now a consumer product, with two major HMDs on the market, with one having a full tracking feature (Room volume tracking + Controller tracking), the other a gamepad, and a much smaller tracked area, the term Roomscale has become a commonality when discussing full, large area tracking, I guess. Technically, roomscale done by Vive can track anything that has their photodiodes installed on it, so roomscale should be called roomscale tracking. I wouldn't be surprised if by Spring 2017 Vive releases tons of accessories to add on to yourself to get a full body tracking feature and other peripherals (plastic guns, swords, sports equipment). So the term roomscale when done by Vive, I think is referring to the laser volume that is generated in your room, and scaled by the users space. With Rift and Touch, the cameras will allow the user to scale his room area as well. 

Now, if roomscale only had a set area to walk around in, but used the non tracked controller still, I think it would totally flop, and become a huge gimmick. Sure, Rift can do minimal area tracking now, it is somewhat impressive, but doesn't really add a whole lot to the experience, other than I can walk up closer to objects rather than sticking my head out as far as the camera will track me when sitting. The controller still has to do all the functions. So, roomscale tracking is not roomscale until the controllers are tracked, or some other device is tracking the persons hands/body to interact in VR - a non tracked device just isn't sufficient for VR, "It's shitty". 

15x15ft is around the max area Vive recommends. Although with their lighthouses, I think it can go well beyond that, the lighthouses just need the sync cable; the distance is constrained by the syncing of the lighthouses (the lasers can go out as far as 20m. As for the minimum I would even consider just standing, "roomscale", as long as there are tracked controllers and enough area around you that you wont whack your hand into something (so a radius of your arm length).

With Rift shipping Touch in the fall, and the apps that are designed for it, I think it will be a very competitive HMD, and will have it's place in VR, and I will consider it roomscale.

  

[VizionVR]

cybereality said:

@VizionVR Yes, I tried room-scale with a Touch setup in the office. It was a moderate-sized space, maybe around 6 x 10 feet or so (limited by the open space in the room). It was lots of fun playing Job Simulator and some of the other titles in the works.

"Some of the other titles in the works"
Care to elaborate? :smile: 

[ThreeDeeVision]

You might as well lump tracked controllers into room-scale because as soon as you get them, the next logical step is to be able track them in a given area.  Standing room setups will still need to cover a person's wingspan and then some (to cover reaching while leaning).  Once you get a taste of tracked controllers, it is only natural to want to take a couple steps and interact with objects like you would in real life.  The more room you can spare, the more natural it will allow your interactions to be.

The name 'room-scale' makes a lot of sense, because it revolves around the space you have available in your room to track the controllers in.  Most of the room-scale games are made to take advantage of that space to the fullest whereas others are made with standing area only in mind.  A game like Audioshield would work great in both 180 degree and 360 degree setups due to the fact it keeps all the action in front of you and your feet stay pretty much stationary, whereas most other room-scale content needs to be perfectly tracked in 360 degrees because the action happens all around you.

[VizionVR]

I would regard the whale encounter in The Blu to be a good example of roomscale without the need for tracked controllers. Another Blu encounter has you holding a flashlight and it is a bit more enjoyable as you are essentially controlling the scene in an additional (and very natural) way which adds immersion.

So though tracked controllers aren't essential for roomscale, they are helpful as immersion devices.

[brantlew]

Agree with the points made about controllers.  "Room-scale" is such an unfortunate description because the most obvious interpretation is that it is about size and range.  I think this contributes to the infighting about whether Rift can do room-scale or not.  Nobody can argue the fact that Vive ships with controllers and Rift does not.  But it is easy to understand why the statement "Rift can't do roomscale" leads to argument and confusion if one person has controllers in their head and another person is simply thinking about tracking range.

[darkcrayon]

Freebirth001 said:

i dont see the point of roomscale.



i live in an apartment.



in my bedroom i have a bed my pc and my dresser/bookshelves. with no way to just wander around.



in my livingroom there is a couch in the middle of the room and a dinning table in the back leading to the kitchen.



my bathroom is tiny



the other room is where my roommate has his bed.





where the hell am i going to use roomscale? who is going to use rokmscale? where?



gow many people have fuckng ballrooms of empty space to play in vr areas? do i have to empty an netire room of stuff to make a vr room? i cant affored to kick out my roomate just for a vr room. and if i did id turn it i to a sex dungeon. that would see far more use than a vr room.

So you don't see the point of it, or you don't have room for it?  Which?  If you really don't see the point, you could've stopped there :smile: 

For me, all I had to do to make a large enough area was simply rotate my coffee table 90 degrees.  And then it takes about 5 seconds to rotate it back.  You know, about the same time it takes when I need to vacuum under it.  Moving a little furniture around for little a taste of Star Trek seems like a worthwhile compromise to me...

[wereman]

I'm happy to use the CV1 as a seated experience most of the time, that's basically all I wanted it for, but from what I have read on the touch controls they are just as good as the vive wands, and i'll be getting them and using them in my lounge when I feel like playing those type of games. 

As for 'room-scale' tracking: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vyNKR_-uKfs

[PassiveVR]

"I have tried roomscale (Vive) and think it's amazing, it's a feature that makes VR better - I own or will own Vive!"

After using it I would never want to be without the option of it! Vanishing Realms is just a fledgling hint of where this could go, even with current physical constraints.

I believe and hope rift can also do it as well before too long, as then we can stop the nay-saying based on which system you have. Seated VR is great, for the right thing, Roomscale VR is amazing for the right thing. VR fans should want it ALL, not be limited by agendas.

So yeah, roomscale is currently my preferred form of VR. I love standing to play, I feel a lot more involved.

About the controller issue, note in my case it's not at all about having motion controlls that I 'feel' roomscale is so awesome. Even when not using anything in my hands, the feeling of being a real entity in a real physical space that reacts to each step, each real lean or crouch, and with accurate tracking in a decent area = roomscale, and that is awesome in itself.

That we also have proper VR controls with Vive means that you can also interact meaningfully in VR and therefore in roomscale VR too, but one doesn't equal the other. Both feel better because of the other. Controls are more important first, but roomscale is the next stage of VR.

Controls bring meaningful interaction and gameplay, roomscale brings massive immersion and sense of space. Combine the two and you have some stunning VR on your hands. It's now all down to the software/PC power to make those spaces even more detailed and tangible.

[DaftnDirect]

@CardinalStorm, my room definitely won't be dedicated to VR, I don't have that many rooms! so the bed will become a futon.. still good for guests to sleep on and when packed up, good for VR observers to sit on!... wall mounted TV will be for guest bedroom veiwing as usual but also for VR observer viewing.

The room isn't big by the way, but room-scale doesn't have to be... just big enough for moving around a bit, provided a little thought goes into what furniture is in there and keep it minimal, i'm also looking into designing a ceiling mounted PC case to make room-scale cable management easy and maximise floor space.

I can see a problem with guests sleeping over though... noises and bumps in the night... stop playing with that Rift!