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RuneSR2
Honored Contributor
July 28, 2018
Question

The destructive force of GREAT VR games getting mediocre or no reviews

When telling my friends and colleagues that VR is mankind's most impressive invention since the wheel, I keep hearing that many will consider buying a VR headset when great games arrive. I can then tell them about the many awesome VR games, but the problem arises when I have to show some reviews of such great VR games. Often there're no reviews or the authors of VR game reviews seem keen to do their very best bashing most VR games for not being good enough - quite contrary to my experiences.

I know Oculus took great pride getting a top-ranked VR game on Metacritic, and they succeeded with Lone Echo last year. But where do we stand this summer? - Here's today's list of the best PC games, including VR games, from Metacritic (and my friends read such lists):



According to that list there are no games you can't play without a VR headset. The only game on the list you can play in VR is The Forest, but it works in 2D too. If the list is expanded to show all current games, Gunheart also receives 83 points like The Forest, and again you don't need a VR headset to play Gunheart. My friends easily conclude that since there're no VR-only high-ranking games on the Metacritic list, it's because current VR games are of poor quality and VR is something no one truly needs. 

I can't blame them for drawing such conclusions, and even showing 2D trailers don't help much, because you can't communicate the greatness of VR games using a 2D video.

I think it's a great problem that new and awesome VR games don't get good reviews or do not get reviewed at all. Let's take Moss - it's a VR-only game arriving a few months ago:

Moss Metacritic Score for PC: No score due to insufficient number of reviews.
Moss User Score in the Oculus Store: About 96% average. 

There're just 3 Moss reviews for PC VR on Metacritic, scoring the game at 79, 80 or 90 % - which in no way reflects user experiences. And often I see a similar trend. 

The reason behind the few Moss PC reviews are probably that many reviewers reviewed the PS4 version and then didn't want to do another review for PC VR. Thus compared to the 3 reviews for the Rift/Vive version, there're 62 reviews of the PS4 version! Interestingly many reviewers have no problem reviewing different game versions for PS4, XBox One and PC - like Battlefield 1, Fifa 18 and Rise of the Tomb Rader just to name a few titles. Why didn't Moss PC VR get a similar treatment?

This is a great problem - Moss for the Rift and Vive is not the same as the PS4 version; PS4 has no controllers matching the Rift or Vive, and the PS4 has much lower resolution (also when using high levels of super-sampling on the Rift and Vive). But the greatness of Moss PC VR was never communicated to the masses, because there're almost no published reviews of one of the greatest VR games so far - and certainly the best one thus far in 2018!

Another problem of mixing VR and 2D games on Metacritic is to compare apples and oranges, or probably more to compare grapes and watermelons 😉

To illustrate: Is Subnautica 2D the same as Subnautica VR? Is Elite Dangerous 2D the same as Elite Dangerous VR? I'd personally consider Subnautica VR about 10 times better than Subnautica 2D, even if the VR version does have some problems. So should we rate Subnautica 2D at 10 % and the VR version at 100 % ? Of course this would not be fair, but I'd have no problem rating Subnautica 2D at 65 % and the VR version at 95 %, if we really want to compare apples and oranges - and want to rate both on the same scale. 
I believe that many reviewers rate VR games just as if the games were in 2D. Comparing 2D and VR games, I'd have a hard time rating a 2D game more than 70 % - and that would be for the very best AAA 2D games, while I'd have a hard time rating any high-quality VR game below 90 %. This is due to the fact that VR games are so incredibly more visually impressive and immersive than any 2D game can be - and Touch controllers add a lot to provide a truly unique VR experience. For example I'd have no problem rating a 2D version of Marvel Powers United at maybe 60 %, and to rate the VR version at 90 %, because the immersion - the feeling of being present in the game world - is so much better in VR. 

If reviewers fail to clearly communicate how much better VR games are compared to 2D games, how are persons - who know very little about VR - going to know how much better VR games are compared to 2D games? The current bashing of Marvel Powers United is a great example of this - and it's a great destructive force limiting VR adoption when VR game reviewers constantly criticize gameplay as if a VR game wasn't different from a 2D game. A new VR game which is the best within it's genre - compared to other VR games in the same genre - is per definition the new reference and should carry a rating reflecting that position. - And such a VR game should not carry a rating that reflects a reviewers preference for 2D games in the genre. 

I think it would be great if Oculus representatives could ask Metacritic not to mix 2D and VR games; there are plenty of VR games to support having their own category.
We need to stop comparing apples and oranges. 

Finally we could take a look on the current top three PC games on Metacritic, namely these:

Into the Breach - rated 89 %


Pillars of Eternity II: Deadfire - rated 88 %


Final Fantasy XV - Windows - rated at 85 %


I do think that some of these games look impressive, but are these games way better than the latest and greatest Rift games? Personally I'd consider the following games so much better; compared to 2D games I'd happily rate Moss at 97 %, Seeking Dawn at 93 % and Marvel Powers United VR at 90 %



    132 replies

    Up and Coming
    July 29, 2018
    Games reviews have nothing to do with good or bad VR sales.  It's nonsense to say people are looking at game review sites and then saying I am not buying a VR headset.  VR headsets can be used for much more than playing games. VR headsets are not a piece of gaming kit.

    The problem VR has until you try it you just can't understand how good VR is. 100% of people including myself  before trying out my Rift didn't have high expectations. Everyone including myself who has tried my Rift has been blow away by it. Even my parents (Dad aged at the time 76 and Mum aged 73)  thought the Rift was amazing.   They need to be finding a way for more people to try VR.  Until you try it you don't know how good VR is.  Maybe they could do more in store demonstrations.to let people see how mazing VR is 

    Another problem VR has is that it is still quite expensive.  To buy a Rift and a PC capable of running it is a big expense for some people.   
    Inspiring
    July 29, 2018
    Certainly left me skint! :D
    Johnny's Scale Models Showcase i5 9600k @4.5GHz; 16GB DDR4 3200; 6xSSD; RTX2080ti; Gigabyte Z390D Mobo Rift CV1; Index; Quest; Quest 2
    Honored Contributor
    July 29, 2018
    Personally I would take YouTube video reviews over things like meta critic...and even then not all of them. Find a reviewer who has similar tastes to you and go from there. For instance I quite like Jim sterlings videos BUT I don't necessarily like all of the same games he does, but "worth a buy" Mac usually likes similar stuff to me. For VR quite like vrgamerdude and gamermuscle for the more simmy vr stuff. There are other too mind you.
    Fiat Coupe, gone. 350Z gone. Dirty nappies, no sleep & practical transport incoming. Thank goodness for VR :)
    Honored Contributor
    July 29, 2018

    Brixmis said:

    Back in the days when PC magazines were the main way of learning what new games were coming out and which were worth looking at reviews were king - since the burst of social networking and the like it has been more about word of mouth from friends and internet buddies imho.
    Half the reviews I read about all kinds of games I think are a real load of crap. Even positive ones often get their facts all wrong, so I take all reviews as just one person's opinion - which is really what they are. And it's a person I don't know, to boot.



    Yes but I look for consistencies in reviews.  For Example, consistencies in Marvel are a Lack of Content and repetitive gameplay.  That's mentioned over and over and over again.  So that's how I'll interpret reviews, not so much the specifics of one individuals review, but if everyone keeps mentioning the same thing.....  You know the saying If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck.....

    Honored Contributor
    July 29, 2018



    Another problem VR has is that it is still quite expensive.  To buy a Rift and a PC capable of running it is a big expense for some people.   



    This for sure!!  My friend just priced out a new computer, it's already at $700 without the GPU or a monitor.  Add $300 if you get a 1060 that people would be led to believe is garbage if you read alot on these enthusiast boards, $700+ if you're mislead into believing that nothing short of a 1080ti will do.  Then $400 for the rift.  That's a tall order especially when they claim the average person in the USA couldn't come up with $600 if an emergency arose.  I don't know how it is in the rest of the world but I suspect it is similar.
    Zenbane
    Honored Contributor
    July 29, 2018


    Games reviews have nothing to do with good or bad VR sales.  It's nonsense to say people are looking at game review sites and then saying I am not buying a VR headset.  VR headsets can be used for much more than playing games. VR headsets are not a piece of gaming kit.



    While it would be nice if this were true, sadly it is not. People most certainly do judge VR based on "gaming," which is why I find myself constantly typing up relies online about how... "VR is more than just gaming." Even the movie, Ready Player One, turned the whole of Virtual Reality in to one big game!

    If you look at the history of debates on this forum surrounding VR's growth and mainstream potential, you will see at least 90% of the rhetoric surrounding video games.
    Inspiring
    July 29, 2018
    Well, regarding price putting people off - the people I am always raving about VR to can easily afford it - they are just skinflints!  Yes, these are the ones who are always saying how much they are looking forward to trying it, but haven't come round to do so in over 2 years I've had it.

    I just say "their loss". But just because people have the money, doesn't mean they are prepared to spend it. So it's not just people being unable to actually afford it. I actually think these people are worried they will get hooked and buy one, but then not have the time to use it as they would like, and so regard it as money wasted.

    PS - and having to stick a box on their heads is also definitely off-putting for many.
    Johnny's Scale Models Showcase i5 9600k @4.5GHz; 16GB DDR4 3200; 6xSSD; RTX2080ti; Gigabyte Z390D Mobo Rift CV1; Index; Quest; Quest 2
    RuneSR2
    RuneSR2Author
    Honored Contributor
    July 29, 2018
    This thread isn't really about getting my friends to buy VR or about Metacritic, but about how we get more people to adopt VR - and that unjustified bad/mediocre reviews may work against VR adoption. I can understand that some of you disagree, which of course is fine, I greatly appreciate other perspectives and the discussion.  

    "Games reviews have nothing to do with good or bad VR sales.  It's nonsense to say people are looking at game review sites and then saying I am not buying a VR headset. "

    I'm convinced that Oculus does not agree - I think it was mentioned at Oculus Connect 4 in a presentation/speech that it was a milestone for Oculus getting top-ranked reviews for a VR game, which Oculus achieved with Lone Echo. I can remember I thought it was unfair that the Oculus rep didn't mention Rez Infinite, because Rez Infinite received similar awesome reviews; then again Rez Infinite isn't VR-only (and isn't an Oculus exclusive game). I'm with Oculus on this one, great reviews are key (and very bad reviews are definitely not ;-). 

    Carmack spent most of his OC4 talk specifying the importance of optimizing apps and games, especially existing apps and games, to increase quality. So Carmack too believes that great software is key - more here. 

    https://youtu.be/vlYL16-NaOw

    I'm not writing to argue that we need a new "Lone Echo"-quality killer-app, although it would be nice (note that Carmack does not speak against killer apps in his talk ;-). I'm convinced we have a lot of "killer-apps" already - but most of them have been crippled by - in my mind - unjustified bad or mediocre reviews, which are being read by the masses who may know very little about VR, potentially limiting any urge for them to adopt VR. 

    I also read this:

    "And I'm not sure VR games deserve better ratting because they're up against games with $100 million budgets and 5 year dev cycles."

    This isn't necessarily the main problem. According to Metacritic the current best PC games are:

    1. Into the Breach - rated 89 %
    2. Pillars of Eternity II: Deadfire - rated 88 %

    None of these games had a $100 million budget or 5 year dev cycle. In fact "Into the breach" is a low-budget indie game. Pillars of Eternity II: Deadfire is crowd funded, the devs wanted litte more than 1 million to make the game, but ended up with 4.4 million (and Pillars of Eternity emerged in 2015, I don't think the devs worked more than max 3 years on the sequel). Thus none of theses games have budgets even close to $100 million. If fact here are some of the top reviews for the low-budget indie game "Into the Breach":




    In short, it certainly doesn't require a $100 million budget to make a great game and get great reviews. 

    This game also just arrived getting an incredibly high Metascore of 88 - it really doesn't look like $100 million and 5 year development, right?

    https://youtu.be/lIOjV-U_3RY

    Actually I don't think we need more killer Rift games - we have a ton - unfortunately Rift VR games get close to no attention from reviewers and often get mediocre reviews. Such non-existent reviews or unjustified bad reviews got my blood pressure so high I just had to start this thread ;-)

    Here's a (fun?) comparison:

    TOP 5 CURRENT PC NON-VR GAMES BY METASCORE:

    Into the Breach - 55 reviews - metascore 89.
    Pillars of Eternity 2 - 67 reviews - metascore 88.
    Final Fantasy XV - 28 reviews - metascore 85.
    Dark Souls Remasted - 8 reviews - metascore 84.
    Frostpunk - 65 reviews - metascore 84. 

    And here are some VR games to compare - also published in 2018:

    Beat Saber - 2 reviews - too few reviews to generate metascore.
    Moss - 3 reviews - too few reviews to generate metascore.
    Red Matter - 2 reviews - too few reviews to generate metascore.
    Psychonauts in the Rhombus of Ruin - 3 reviews - too few reviews to generate metascore.
    Seeking Dawn - 7 reviews - metascore 69. 

    And some older VR-only games, where reviewers have had 6+ months or even years to write a review:

    Robinson: The Journey - 2 reviews - too few reviews to generate metascore.
    The Invisible Hours - 3 reviews - too few reviews to generate metascore.
    Serious Sam VR: The last hope - 2 reviews - too few reviews to generate metascore.
    Landfall - 1 review - too few reviews to generate metascore.
    Chronos - 13 reviews - metascore 77. 
    Wilson's Heart - 10 reviews - metascore 79. 
    Mage's Tale - 12 reviews - metascore 72 (Thanks to VRFocus for rating this game 100 % - I couldn't agree more, ok maybe 96 % is more appropriate, it isn't Lone Echo ;-)
    Edge of Nowhere - 11 reviews - metascore 71.
    Lucky's Tale - 12 reviews - metascore 64. 

    Maybe Lucky's Tale is 64/100 to some; to me it's a solid 95 %, I truly love that game - especially using SS 2.0; Mario is so dead - long live Lucky! ;-) All the kids trying Lucky's Tale in our house completely agree - Mario is so dead :-)
    I even tried to play some Rise of the Tomb Raider and Battlefield 1, all settings maxed running 60+ fps, to see if I was missing something - but having been exposed to VR such AAA 2D games couldn't interest me for long, I've really lost any motivation for playing pancake games.

    To sum up - either the most awesome VR games get close to no reviews - or they get mediocre or even bad reviews, I really don't understand why. And I think it's a great problem (as mentioned above). 

    Maybe I should have called this thread "Why do awesome VR games get no or so many mediocre reviews - and what are the consequences?"  ;)

    BTW, currently Lone Echo has 14 reviews and a metascore of 89 - I guess that's fair enough...
    Oculus Rift CV1, Valve Index & PSVR2, Asus Strix OC RTX™ 3090, i9-10900K (5.3Ghz), 32GB 3200MHz, 16TB SSD "Ask not what VR can do for you, but what you can do for VR"
    Inspiring
    July 29, 2018

    RuneSR2 said:

    This thread isn't really about getting my friends to buy VR


    But there isn't much else that we, here, can actually do or speak about who is or isn't buying VR gear.

    What those promoting it commercially can or will do is beyond our control and has been discussed at length on many forums - including this one. Doesn't change anything, though, as I don't think anyone expects it to.
    Johnny's Scale Models Showcase i5 9600k @4.5GHz; 16GB DDR4 3200; 6xSSD; RTX2080ti; Gigabyte Z390D Mobo Rift CV1; Index; Quest; Quest 2
    RuneSR2
    RuneSR2Author
    Honored Contributor
    July 29, 2018

    Brixmis said:


    RuneSR2 said:

    This thread isn't really about getting my friends to buy VR


    But there isn't much else that we, here, can actually do or speak about who is or isn't buying VR gear.

    What those promoting it commercially can or will do is beyond our control and has been discussed at length on many forums - including this one. Doesn't change anything, though, as I don't think anyone expects it to.


    True, of course we can try to promote VR locally to our best efforts; I don't know how much it'll work on a larger scale. I can't even convince my friends to get a 1080 or better, although they really need it and easily can afford it. 
    Oculus Rift CV1, Valve Index & PSVR2, Asus Strix OC RTX™ 3090, i9-10900K (5.3Ghz), 32GB 3200MHz, 16TB SSD "Ask not what VR can do for you, but what you can do for VR"