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RuneSR2
RuneSR2
Honored Contributor
June 16, 2021
Question

Sony next-gen PlayStation5 VR 120Hz 4K oled hmd (=PSVR2) - can now be used for PCVR too!

 

EDIT: See the new specs here:

 

https://www.roadtovr.com/sony-playstation-vr-2-announcement-psvr-2-specs-field-of-view/

 

Original post:

 

Close to breaking news - if true - I just love oled so much more than LCD (well at least if oled gets similar ultra-low SDE like modern lcd panels):

 

"One important holdout remains: Sony Group Corp. plans to use Samsung Display Co. OLED panels in its next-generation PlayStation VR goggles, according to people with knowledge of the matter. The Japanese console giant sold more than 5 million units of the original PS VR, launched in 2016, and is aiming to release the successor in the holiday period next year, the people said, asking not to be named discussing internal plans."

 

Source: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-06-16/fading-iphone-lcd-screen-maker-pivots-to-virtual-reality

 

Depending on the panel, lcd could still have more subpixels and higher res (like Vive Pro 2) - there're tons of things we don't know yet. And Sony hasn't confirmed anything. 

 

Red arrow marks the arrival (first impact) of PSVR2 oled 🙂

 

 

Spoiler


 

 

    243 replies

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    RuneSR2
    RuneSR2Author
    Honored Contributor
    July 1, 2024

    August 7 you'll be able to use PSVR2 for PCVR as Sony releases an adapter making it possible to connect PSVR2 to a PC:

    Sony recommends using a RTX 3060 or better video card:

    Minimum PC requirements

    Here are the minimum requirements for PS VR2 gameplay on PC:

    Operating system Windows 10 64-bit / Windows 11 64-bit 
    Processor Intel Core i5-7600 / AMD Ryzen 3 3100 (Zen 2 or later architecture is required)
    RAM / memory 8 GB or more
    GPU / graphics card -NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1650 or later (Turing or later architecture is required)
    -NVIDIA RTX series
    -AMD Radeon RX 5500XT or later / AMD Radeon RX 6500XT or later
    (For the best performance, we recommend that you use an NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3060 or later or AMD Radeon RX 6600XT or later graphics card)
    DisplayPort DisplayPort 1.4 (must have a standard DisplayPort or Mini DisplayPort output port)
    USB Direct connection only
    Bluetooth Bluetooth 4.0 or later**

     

    Now, Sony seems to need special drivers for SteamVR, like other non-Valve hmds, and this is as always a red flag. Using same software res, Valve Index is about 30-40% faster than Quest 3 Link in native SteamVR apps (because Index uses native Steam drivers), and chances are PSVR2 could also take a giant performance hit compared to running native SteamVR drivers. 

    We need to see some performance benchmarks to judge how good - or bad - the PSVR2 will be on the PC. 

    Sony will not support eye tracked foveated rendering, advanced haptics nor HDR, so some have expressed that this is a big disappointment - but there really are no PCVR games supporting those features anyway. 

    With PSVR2 for PCVR you should get big fov, high res oled, 120 Hz and probably same great tracking as when using the PS5. For about $500, this would probably be the best panels you can get for the price - other oled solutions for PCVR are much more expensive. 

    Getting oled, 120 Hz and big fov for about $500 could be a great deal, especially if Sony gets great SteamVR performance. We'll see in a month. 

    Btw, there have been many Reddit posts about getting Alyx for the PSVR2. I guess there's much truth found in this saying: "If the Mountain won’t go to Mohammed, then Mohammed must come to the Mountain" - and it seems like Sony had to make a journey they initially may have hoped to avoid 😁 

    Oculus Rift CV1, Valve Index & PSVR2, Asus Strix OC RTX™ 3090, i9-10900K (5.3Ghz), 32GB 3200MHz, 16TB SSD "Ask not what VR can do for you, but what you can do for VR"
      TomCgcmfc
      Honored Contributor
      July 1, 2024

      RuneSR2  you said;

      "Now, Sony seems to need special drivers for SteamVR, like other non-Valve hmds, and this is as always a red flag. Using same software res, Valve Index is about 30-40% faster than Quest 3 Link in native SteamVR apps (because Index uses native Steam drivers), and chances are PSVR2 could also take a giant performance hit compared to running native SteamVR drivers."

      I know what you mean that non-native SteamVR headsets need to use addon software to play SteamVR apps.  I have a Vive Pro1, which is the last Vive headset that is true native SteamVR (same as Index).  I also run a Q3 and QPro with a Link cable and the performance difference is much lower than you suggest.  I've estimated that the performance difference is only about 10% and this is mainly due to the extra gpu resources required for compression/encoding versus DP data transfer.  With complex flight sims like msfs2020 I get around this performance difference by running my Quest headsets at 80Hz refresh rate vs 90Hz with my VP1.  Maybe my lower performance differences are due to my higher end PC (i913900k/rtx4090/32Gb 6400ram/z790mb) but I don't recall much of a performance difference even with my old rtx3090 setup.  Likewise, I don't see a lot of performance difference running my Quest headsets with the Oculus runtimes vs SteamVR runtimes.  Maybe 5% difference max.  Again, probably depends a lot on your system setup and settings, but I don't think its as high as 20-30%.

      In any case, it will be interesting to see how well the PSVR2 headset performs with SteamVR.  If it turns out to be very good I may be tempted to buy one to replace my good old amoled VP1.  Time will tell I guess.  Cheers mate.

      i9 13900K water cooled, RTX4090, Z790 MB w/wifi6e, 64Gb 6400 ram, 2x2TB SSD, 1000W PSU, Win 11, QPro, Q3, w/Link and Air Link, Vive Pro1 with 2x2.0 base stations, Etsy lens mod and Index Controllers
        RuneSR2
        RuneSR2Author
        Honored Contributor
        July 1, 2024

        Pyroth tested Index vs Quest 3 using the same software res and the same rig with RTX 3090, see the last post in the Index thread. Quest 3 lost the most using Link, Virtual Desktop (VD) was better - and maybe PSVR2 can use VD too, if that's needed.

        Also note the great performance difference is only in games needing native SteamVR drivers and not supporting OpenXR. If a SteamVR game supports OpenXR,  or the old native Oculus drivers, you'll get close to the same performance as the Index.

        Although many newer games support OpenXR, the majority of my SteamVR games do not support OpenXR. I also measured 20 - 25% performance loss with the Index when using Revive, so it does go both ways - for optimal performance it's good to have both a Meta hmd and a hmd with native SteamVR driver support.

        Then again, your 4090 is so fast you may not notice a let's say 20% performance reduction in a game like Vertigo 2, which does not support OpenXR 🙂

        Varjo Aero lost much more in native SteamVR apps, here Index was about 50% faster due to bad drivers from Varjo. So I'm very interested in seeing how well Sony makes drivers - Pimax actually did impress, here, Index and Vive Pro were only 15% faster using same res in the OpenVR Benchmark. 

        Oculus Rift CV1, Valve Index & PSVR2, Asus Strix OC RTX™ 3090, i9-10900K (5.3Ghz), 32GB 3200MHz, 16TB SSD "Ask not what VR can do for you, but what you can do for VR"
          RuneSR2
          RuneSR2Author
          Honored Contributor
          July 7, 2024

          Mare is coming to PSVR2 with the option to use eye tracking to control the character you play - but I still think to PCVR version looks better 🙂

           

          See this thread for the PCVR version:

          https://communityforums.atmeta.com/t5/VR-Experiences/Mare-has-launched-for-PC-a-somewhat-mediocre-game-but-still-a/m-p/955799

           

          Mare is a great game not to be missed!

          Oculus Rift CV1, Valve Index & PSVR2, Asus Strix OC RTX™ 3090, i9-10900K (5.3Ghz), 32GB 3200MHz, 16TB SSD "Ask not what VR can do for you, but what you can do for VR"
          RuneSR2
          RuneSR2Author
          Honored Contributor
          July 22, 2024

          I'm happy to see this great game arriving for the PSVR2 in a few days:

           

          I still have not finished it, but it gets really hard in the later levels, maybe time for a swing later today? 🤔 😀

          Also great to see that devs can get some more financial support through the PSVR2 - and this game should work in high res in 90 or 120 fps with the PS5. 

          Graphics look the same as PCVR - and again the PSVR2 is getting a game I'm not going to buy - I only buy PSVR2 exclusives, Steam always wins. 

           

          Oculus Rift CV1, Valve Index & PSVR2, Asus Strix OC RTX™ 3090, i9-10900K (5.3Ghz), 32GB 3200MHz, 16TB SSD "Ask not what VR can do for you, but what you can do for VR"
          RuneSR2
          RuneSR2Author
          Honored Contributor
          July 26, 2024

          It's coming - Steam page up:

          https://store.steampowered.com/app/2580190/PlayStationVR2_App/

          System Requirements

          Minimum:
            • Requires a 64-bit processor and operating system
            • OS: Windows 10/11
            • Processor: Intel Core i5 7600 / AMD Ryzen 3 3100*¹
            • Memory: 8 GB RAM
            • Graphics: NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1650 or later*² / NVIDIA RTX Series / AMD Radeon RX 5500XT or later / Radeon RX 6500XT or later
            • Storage: 700 MB available space
            • Additional Notes: *¹ Zen 2 or later architecture is required
              *² Turing or later architecture is required
          Recommended:
            • Requires a 64-bit processor and operating system
            • Graphics: NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3060 or later / AMD Radeon RX 6600XT or later
           
          Oculus Rift CV1, Valve Index & PSVR2, Asus Strix OC RTX™ 3090, i9-10900K (5.3Ghz), 32GB 3200MHz, 16TB SSD "Ask not what VR can do for you, but what you can do for VR"
            RuneSR2
            RuneSR2Author
            Honored Contributor
            July 28, 2024

            The great PSVR2 price drop just hit the US too:

             

            Sony probably did this to increase PCVR adoption, but what I'm seeing on Reddit is many PS5 owners buying cheap PSVR2 hmds - so this price reduction could end up boosting PSVR2 + PS5 a lot more than PSVR2 + PC, we'll see. 

            Personally I would not buy any PSVR2 hmd for PC before reviews are in. Many games on SteamVR require proper support for hmds and controllers - even today you can find games like Tomb Explorer which only support Rift, Quest and Index. Be careful getting PSVR2 thinking all SteamVR games will work (also for the performance) - at least until we see reviews.  

            Oculus Rift CV1, Valve Index & PSVR2, Asus Strix OC RTX™ 3090, i9-10900K (5.3Ghz), 32GB 3200MHz, 16TB SSD "Ask not what VR can do for you, but what you can do for VR"
              RuneSR2
              RuneSR2Author
              Honored Contributor
              July 29, 2024

              Seems the PSVR2 is outselling almost anything else at the moment, also in the US, including Quest 3:

              https://www.reddit.com/r/PSVR/s/UkkjgAtcjn

              Maybe Sony should have done that long ago. Carmack said Quest 3 sells at cost, so Meta do not make money from the hardware, but from the software. Since Sony gets a big cut from everything sold in the PlayStation Store, selling PSVR2 at cost could have boosted adoption a lot - and maybe that can still happen now. 

              The current low PSVR2 price is a limited time offer according to Sony, so the price may soon go up... Fun thing, at launch I paid $750 for mine bundled with Call of the Mountain - but we don't get warm prices here in the North 😉

              Oculus Rift CV1, Valve Index & PSVR2, Asus Strix OC RTX™ 3090, i9-10900K (5.3Ghz), 32GB 3200MHz, 16TB SSD "Ask not what VR can do for you, but what you can do for VR"
              RuneSR2
              RuneSR2Author
              Honored Contributor
              July 30, 2024

              Again, I really think this boost is due to PS5 owners, not due to users wanting PSVR2 for PC:

              Exclusive: PSVR 2 sales surge over 2,000% after Sony's huge price drop

              Update: Sony PlayStation VR 2 has sold out at Amazon, as sales spike for the PS5 VR headset. Here's the story of how things changed in just 24 hours.

               

              Read it all here:

              https://www.theshortcut.com/p/exclusive-psvr-2-sales-spike

              Oculus Rift CV1, Valve Index & PSVR2, Asus Strix OC RTX™ 3090, i9-10900K (5.3Ghz), 32GB 3200MHz, 16TB SSD "Ask not what VR can do for you, but what you can do for VR"
              RuneSR2
              RuneSR2Author
              Honored Contributor
              July 30, 2024

              Btw, PS5 Pro is expected late this year - and probably will be 3 times faster than the PS5:

              • 💨 CPU /Clock Speeds: 8-core/16 thread Zen 2 CPU at 3.5GHz/3.85GHz

              • 💪 GPU Compute Units/ Architecture: 60 CUs, RNDA 3 (TBC

              • 🚄 TFLOPs/GPU Clock Speed: 33.5TF/2.18GHz (TBC)

              • 💭 GDDR6 Memory: 16GB at 18Gbps

              • 🎮 Memory Available For Games: 13.7GB

              • 📏 Memory Interface/Bandwidth: 256-bit/576GB/s

               

              https://www.theshortcut.com/p/ps5-pro-release-date-edges-closer

              The PS5 can do 10 tflops - compared to the 34 tflops listed above for the PS5 Pro. If true, that will give the PS5 Pro similar power as the RTX 3090, but with less ram. Also RTX 3090 has 936GB/s mem bandwidth, 63% more than 576GB/s. 

              The PS5 Pro would be worthless to me if it doesn't come with new great games for PSVR2 - not going to play the old games again just because I can get solid 120 fps instead of 60 fps with reprojections. 

              That said, a PS5 Pro with 34 tflops in 2024 would be serious competition for high-end PC pancake lovers - if Sony keeps the price low. 

              Could explain why Sony is not going to fund more PSVR2 + PS5 exclusive games, if the PS5 Pro is close 🤔

              34 tflops would also allow devs to port PCVR games directly to PS5 Pro, no reductions or down-scaling needed. That could be interesting... Well, maybe my son needs my old PS5 in his room after all 🤔 🤗

              EDIT: Did a bit more digging - The Verge says PS5 Pro is unlikely to deliver 3 x PS5 gpu performance:

              "The existing PS5 is a 10.28-teraflop console, but comparing teraflops directly between these consoles is complicated due to changes in AMD’s RDNA architecture. While it sounds like tripling the teraflops would be a significant performance increase on the GPU side, comparing the base PS5 and PS5 Pro would be closer to 10.28 teraflops vs. around 17 teraflops."

              https://www.theverge.com/2024/3/15/24102378/sony-ps5-pro-leak-specs-release-date-rumor

              I guess we'll see when the PS5 launches... 

              Oculus Rift CV1, Valve Index & PSVR2, Asus Strix OC RTX™ 3090, i9-10900K (5.3Ghz), 32GB 3200MHz, 16TB SSD "Ask not what VR can do for you, but what you can do for VR"
                RuneSR2
                RuneSR2Author
                Honored Contributor
                August 2, 2024

                Maybe Thomas is slightly overenthusiastic here, but I do like him, he owns close to every hmd out there - in short, the PSVR2 seems to work great for the hmd, but controller performance may depend on your Bluetooth support:

                 

                I'd await more reviews to find out if the Bluetooth controller issue is real... For $60 I'd expect Sony to have included a Bluetooth receiver to avoid any issues and a DisplayPort cable - now you need to buy a separate DisplayPort cable, it all adds up if you need to buy cable and new Bluetooth adapter... 

                Small in-ear headphones are included with the PSVR2, but is not an optimal audio solution - so that may add more costs. PSVR2 was originally made to work with the Sony Pulse3D closed-ear headphones, costing about $100. This is what I use: 

                I don't know if Pulse3D works perfectly with the PC, also for the 3D-like sound effects. This is the sound you can get in PSVR2 using the PS5, but I'm not sure PC will be similar 🤔

                 

                Using PC + PSVR2 + Pulse3D could add latency for the sound, which is a common issue replacing the Rift CV1 headphones with other external wireless headphones - this is no issue with PS5 + Pulse3D + PSVR2, but no clue how that works with the PC. 

                Also no clue if you can add PSVR2 to a PC and still keep the Index or Quest 3 connected for SteamVR - and switch to whatever you prefer.

                The performance cost of Sony's extra layer of drivers is also unknown - Alyx will autoadapt to highest possible res where the game can use 90 or 120 fps - and Thomas using a RTX 4090 may never be exposed to real performance issues in Alyx. We need to see the performance in a benchmark like the OpenVR Benchmark to truly see the performance. 

                Thus many questions are still completely unanswered.  

                Oculus Rift CV1, Valve Index & PSVR2, Asus Strix OC RTX™ 3090, i9-10900K (5.3Ghz), 32GB 3200MHz, 16TB SSD "Ask not what VR can do for you, but what you can do for VR"
                  RuneSR2
                  RuneSR2Author
                  Honored Contributor
                  August 4, 2024

                  Like Nixon and the Watergate scandal, Sony may be greatly surprised by the Bluetoothgate scandal 😁 🤓

                   

                  But we oldtimers knew never to buy anything before reviews - there's always something wrong with new tech, well mostly at least. And especially hmd-related stuff almost never comes without some friction 😎

                  Whenever we get new stuff, I normally think of "what could possible go wrong?" - And this dear fellow often springs to mind 🤗

                  In a worst-case-scenario, PSVR2 + PC may still be awesome for simmers not needing the controllers - and of course it still works perfectly with the PS5. 

                  Sony is used to most users having the exact same hardware, so if it works for one it works for all. Here the PC waters are very different 😅

                  Oculus Rift CV1, Valve Index & PSVR2, Asus Strix OC RTX™ 3090, i9-10900K (5.3Ghz), 32GB 3200MHz, 16TB SSD "Ask not what VR can do for you, but what you can do for VR"
                  kojack
                  kojack
                  Honored Contributor
                  August 4, 2024
                  RuneSR2 wrote:

                  But we oldtimers knew never to buy anything before reviews - there's always something wrong with new tech, well mostly at least. And especially hmd-related stuff almost never comes without some friction 😎

                  I wish I followed that for the HP Reverb G2. 😞

                   

                  Author: Oculus Monitor , Auto Oculus Touch , Forum Dark Mode , Phantom Touch Remover , X-Plane Fixer Hardware: Threadripper 1950x, MSI Gaming Trio 2080TI, Asrock X399 Taich Headsets: Wrap 1200VR, DK1, DK2, CV1, Rift-S, GearVR, Go, Quest, Quest 2, Reverb G2, Quest 3
                    RuneSR2
                    RuneSR2Author
                    Honored Contributor
                    August 4, 2024

                    Admitted, in the previous post I may have sounded more holy than I am  - I did order the Index after only seeing like 5 YouTube reviews, normally I'd see more than 10 and especially check out the more unbiased user reviews - but rumors said the first wave of Index hmds was about to sell out, I had to be quick, lol. And Index did have several issues too. 

                    Most should be able to return the PSVR2 PCVR adapter if it does not work. But my worries are not so much about that - it's more that VR does not need more friction. I had hoped PSVR2 to PC could be a great success story, now I'm less convinced. 

                    For Bluetooth, I use my mainboard from Asus - the mainboard was quite expensive. If Sony has not tested their adapter with popular mainboard brands, they may have shot themselves in the foot with a really big gun... VoodooDE uses a RTX 4090, I bet he has a high-end mainboard too - so I do worry that the Bluetoothgate scandal will be very real... We'll see next week - and if Sony may fix/lessen this issue with updated software... 

                    Oculus Rift CV1, Valve Index & PSVR2, Asus Strix OC RTX™ 3090, i9-10900K (5.3Ghz), 32GB 3200MHz, 16TB SSD "Ask not what VR can do for you, but what you can do for VR"
                    kojack
                    kojack
                    Honored Contributor
                    August 4, 2024

                    Bluetooth has always been a problematic protocol. Good idea, but so many incompatibilities. I remember the earlier days trying to use Wiimotes on PC, different adapters, firmware and software stacks all had issues. Or some adapters came with crappy limited firmware and you had to pay for the better firmware.

                    Oculus/Meta only really used standard bluetooth for one headset: the Go (and the GearVR I guess). All the others used a slight non standard modification to Bluetooth with the correct hardware in the controllers and headset (and sensors for CV1, but that was only used to sync the cameras, not for controller receiving).

                     

                    Author: Oculus Monitor , Auto Oculus Touch , Forum Dark Mode , Phantom Touch Remover , X-Plane Fixer Hardware: Threadripper 1950x, MSI Gaming Trio 2080TI, Asrock X399 Taich Headsets: Wrap 1200VR, DK1, DK2, CV1, Rift-S, GearVR, Go, Quest, Quest 2, Reverb G2, Quest 3
                      RuneSR2
                      RuneSR2Author
                      Honored Contributor
                      August 7, 2024

                      I think I'm too lazy unplugging the PSVR2 from the PS5, and just the thought of the hassle getting access to the back of my rig - without having to unplug Index and CV1 (using in total 7 usb and display connectors). Also the PSVR2 feels more made for PS5 with all the haptics, HDR and eye tracked foveated rendering - the hmd does feel much amputated for PC. And then all the potential Bluetooth issues...

                      Image quality does look similar to Quest 3 though, click to see full size:

                      From Reddit

                      What this image does not capture at all are the blacks. PSVR2, when it shines, is pitch black - even way beyond the CV1, due to the CV1 spud. I think PSVR2 can be a great solution for those who do not already own a PCVR hmd, who want oled blacks, and who do not mind spending time getting optimal Bluetooth support. 

                      I'm perfectly happy with the Index - I even still love my CV1 🙂 Also I think standard res in SteamVR for the PSVR2 was like 3000x3000 and with only 120 Hz supported, if I add some super-sampling to reduce jaggies (which still can be seen), not sure my RTX 3090 is the optimal choice for such extreme res.

                      Actually I consider the RTX 3090 the perfect match for my Rift CV1 ss 2.5, finally I could play Stormland with all the bells and whistles in 90 fps. RTX 5090 will probably be the same for the 144 Hz Index res 400+ % (where Index really shines), right now I'm mostly using 80 fps + res 250 - 400 % with the Index - thus hmds with even higher res like PSVR2 may profit greatly from future gpus (even beyond 5090)... 

                      Like some say 😇 🤗

                       

                      Oculus Rift CV1, Valve Index & PSVR2, Asus Strix OC RTX™ 3090, i9-10900K (5.3Ghz), 32GB 3200MHz, 16TB SSD "Ask not what VR can do for you, but what you can do for VR"
                        TomCgcmfc
                        Honored Contributor
                        August 8, 2024

                        RuneSR2  Sorry to see you aren't going for the PCVR adapter with your PSVR2 headset.  I was hoping to hear your honest opinion on this before deciding if this would be a worthy upgrade to my Vive Pro1, mainly for flight sims.  I guess I'll have to wait for some independant reviews over the next month or so.  Cheers mate.

                        i9 13900K water cooled, RTX4090, Z790 MB w/wifi6e, 64Gb 6400 ram, 2x2TB SSD, 1000W PSU, Win 11, QPro, Q3, w/Link and Air Link, Vive Pro1 with 2x2.0 base stations, Etsy lens mod and Index Controllers
                          RuneSR2
                          RuneSR2Author
                          Honored Contributor
                          August 8, 2024

                          MRTV has now changed his opinion - apparently his Bluetooth chip worked flawlessly with the adapter:

                           

                          Need more reviews though - Pyroth309 is not picking it up either - I did suggest that he tried it first, lol 🤓

                          Surely Alyx will work, Sony tested that - let's try Hello Neighbor VR, a game where full controller support seems to matter - where my Index controllers were dead until the devs actively supported these controllers. 

                          I see many games where users cry about lacking WMR, Pimax and Varjo support - let's test the PSVR2 with the more rare games... I do wonder if Sony aimed for full Quest 3 or Index controllers compatibility, if they did my money would be on Quest 3 as PSVR2 controllers lack buttons to fully replicate Index controllers...

                          Oculus Rift CV1, Valve Index & PSVR2, Asus Strix OC RTX™ 3090, i9-10900K (5.3Ghz), 32GB 3200MHz, 16TB SSD "Ask not what VR can do for you, but what you can do for VR"
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