Mad Genius Motion Capture System proof-of-concept prototype

What they've demonstrated is that Skyrim has high input lag. If they wanted to demonstrate that their controller has low input lag, they'd have done better by showing a visualization of the tracking output on a PC (which was shown in the previous video, so they already have one to hand).


Responding to a question on their controller's input lag with a video that doesn't even feature their controller does not inspire me with confidence.

"Drigien" wrote:

"edzieba" wrote:

Single coil

Current guesses:
1) Single coil sensor, single emitter-triplet, using IMU to guess orientation of sensor in order to infer range from emitter.
2) Single coil emitter, multiple sensors (maybe those copper-ish objects arranged around the TV?), using time-delay or relative field strength to detect orientation and position.

It looks like they are just tracking position, nothing in the video showed any orientation tracking.

Yup. That seems like it.

"MadGeniusControllers" wrote:
The tracking method locates the controller's (x,y,z) position directly. There's no sensor drift because it measures position rather than acceleration.

"MadGeniusControllers" wrote:
No gyro, no accelerometer, no magnetometer. (x,y,z) is measured directly.

So I had a chance to visit Mad Genius at the Murata booth today during CES.

Much to my surprise, they're using an ultrasonic tracking system! From my time with it, I discovered that is is indeed a very very capable system!

He quoted that it is/will be accurate to about 1/100", is capable of refresh rates as high as 50 hz, and is immune to the vast majority of common noise interference. After seeing the demo, I had no reason to disbelieve him.

The only drawbacks that I could see are that it is highly susceptible to line-of-sight/occlusion interference and that it requires four "base stations" to be placed at large distances around the TV to measure the ultrasound emitted by the beeper (the device being tracked) (doesn't actually make any hearable noise :roll: ).

A neat feature of the system is that the beeps can be "dumb" in that they could just be a battery emitting ultrasound on a timer. Tracking multiple points like this, however, will probably need an alternate form of identification (and halve the refresh rate per point).

I am very interested in them and looking forward to their future plans.

Two thoughts :
- This controller works fine without an Oculus Rift. In fact it might even work better without an Oculus Rift, as far as moving around without colliding with non virtual object goes. It makes me think this would have been better off released BEFORE the Oculus Rift revolution, as it's own thing, then marketed as an Oculus Rift add-on.
- Even if Skyrim wasn't directly responsible for the huge input lag (which it definitely is, by design)... the other problem with using that video to judge the input lag of the controller is that the TV itself introduces a decent amount of lag (easily 40ms and more, even when the TV is using it's game mode, and higher priced TVs tend to increase the amount of input lag rather then reduce it, through their extra layers of picture enhancements). So in fact it's mostly impossible to use the video of a any kind of existing "huge" TV to directly judge the amount of input lag of any input controller to begin with :)

Again, I see the body moving part of this controller working better without the use of an Oculus Rift then with one, as a cheap replacement to using a similar controller with a 300$ Oculus Rift + 500$ Treadmil.

As far as using it with an Oculus Rift, I would suggest not using the controller's body movement capacity at all, and combining it with a 360° Treadmil for the body movement instead (unless you don't mind ending up bashing into your TV because of your limited Oculus Rift sight).

Instead of combining it with a Virtual Reality Headset like the Oculus Rift, you could combine it with an Augmented Reality Headset, this would remove my negative comments about ramming yourself into non virtual objects with the body tracking (since augmented reality allows you to see those non virtual objects surrounding you), removing the need for a 500$ Treadmill, and you could even use the Augmented Reality to overlay virtual weapons directly into your own real life hands (sword, bow, machine gun... whatever), instead of having those weapons displayed in virtual hands on a screen displayed in front of you (possibly also removing the need for the huge TV itself, since an Augmented Reality headset could created a Virtual TV for you).

Also, maybe this could be marketed as an alternative set of controllers for a STEM system, instead of developing it's own ultrasonic tracking system ?

Either way, maybe use a game with no in-built game lag to demonstrate it (instead of using Skyrim + an explanation on in-built game lag). Just remember that almost all modern huge sized TVs introduce 2+ frames of game lag to begin with (even in their faster game mode).

Just my thoughts, I haven't tried it.

PS : I'm assuming the first consumer version of Oculus Rift won't be (directly) offering Augmented Reality, because there's no official statement that it will, and because just providing Virtual Reality is a mouthful already (I can still see Augmented Reality being added to Oculus Rift later on, because despite the hurdles it's just too good to remain permanently missed out).

"LeftStep" wrote:
...

Thank you. Seems he already figured out Skyrim wasn't the best game to demonstrate because of it's in-built lag (although I find the Skyrim demo more impressive then that one, in both game graphics and controller demonstration).
The problem is that youtubers are still spotting the TV lag, and mistaking it with game control input lag... And the problem there is that the only way to fix that TV lag is to use a lag free TV, which only exists in smaller sizes at this time (only up to 27 inch for zero lag input displays).

My opinion :
- The weak point is that the setup seems bulky (users are already complaining about the Crystal Cove adding one single external tracking device, and the Mad Genius Motion seems to be using a whole handful of them). Also I can see PC gamers wanting the enhanced body tracking experience of a multi STEM system (and the software support it will likely receive on PC).
- The strong point is that this works on ANY existing game, with no game developer change or PC driver required, including XBone, PS4, and all the previous console models, and all those consoles don't have and probably won't get the STEM system.

Would I buy this : No, because as a PC gamer I would rather buy the STEM system instead. But I would have been a lot more interested if I had been a console gamer, if only due to it's unique compatibility and even backwards compatibility with most games from any console (which the PC dedicated Razor Hydra doesn't offer).

So wrong input device for me, but still an awesome proof of concept for the right user (console input devices are notoriously inaccurate and/or laggy, and even if a youtube video can't prove it it seems this one isn't).

They've done a demo with the rift. And it is looking pretty good.

Its not bad considering they seem to be the first in out of the box concepts.

I wonder who is going to be the first company to get 1:1 out of the box.

Their Kickstarter project for the devkit is up.

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1781631932/mad-genius-precision-motion-gaming-any-console-any