The Index thread (please keep to subject)

Yes I have never seen so many conflicting reviews Jeez

Luciferous said:

Yes I have never seen so many conflicting reviews Jeez

I just don't trust any of the YouTube reviews tbh. I watched the Tested YouTube review about about Rift S and they said the tracking was good when in-fact it was shite before the recent update. I do believe glare is an issue though in the index and it's the one thing I hate about the CV1.

81 Index owners have participated in a survey - we don't know if people with issues have been more inclined to participate or not. Click to enlarge:

Hello, I see lots of activity and I read a few reviews here and im not surprised. I will keep mine short and sweet before I read others.

The build quality is awesome. Overall package it came in is excellent.

I could be alone in this, but this is my overall opinion.

My Vive pro is almost better then the Index in every way.
-Comfort - but dont get me wrong it is comfortable, but not as much as my pro.
-Colors - Washed out a bit, black levels are not as dark as the pro, but not a big issue though.
-Sound - Pro has just as good, if not better.
-WAY less screen door effect - I've been spoiled by the Pro, so this shit was off putting. (it was the first thing I saw, and I instantly said to myself, this cannot be right)
-Refresh rate - ABSOLUTELY no impact on me, maybe im weird, but I tried 120hz, and 144.. couldn't see a difference for shit. (and this was what I thought would make the biggest impact)
-Wireless - I assume valve will be working on a solution for that though.
-Keeping the outside world out - the nose guard lets light in a bit, and of course the audio is not closed in.. The Pro, takes me to another place which I personally like.

I'm just super glad this equipment is compatible with my Pro, obviously the controllers are awesome.

Some things of note. I can see farther more clearer with the index(only slightly), but the trade off to me isn't worth the other things I miss out on. I'm glad I got it, and I'm going to look into the color fix that was posted in this thread. There is a washed out haze coupled with some screen glare that I cannot put my finger on, I have to really adjust it to get it in focus. I was ready and willing to sell my Pro, but its not going to happen. I guess I need more time in it to really evaluate it. And the larger FOV is nothing to write home about, not enough to even mention imo, but this is part of my edit.

Again, more time is needed...

I love that it is way easier to get it all started than my pimax. But now I have to sell it and nobody wants it anymore :(

Must say that it's hard to keep up the motivation with these reviews - this is another CV1 to Index, and probably a great one, but it more or less concludes that the CV1 is nearly just as great (I've put some text in bold):

And where are we after a few days - some pros and cons:

1. Lighthouses. Pros: Best tracking ever, require no USB connection just power. Cons: Several users complain that lighthouses make a high-pitched whine/sound when active that ruined immersion to some, some don't hear the lighthouses though, but the lighthouses aren't completely silent like the CV1 sensors. More cumbersome to set up compared to Rift-S tracking. 

2. HMD. Pros: 144 Hz, large FOV , nice res, physical IPD adjustement, almost no SDE. Cons: Beware when using glasses, high FOV (= short distance between glasses and lenses) have already resulted in scratched lenses for some users. No true blacks like OLED, many can't see difference between 90 and 120+ Hz, muted colors, massive immersion-reducing glare that may not be the same as god rays, HMD gets hot on the outside.  

3. Sound. Pros: The best sound ever in a HMD, great 3D audio, much better than Rift-S. Cons: Off-ear placement lets in immersion breaking sounds and noises from the real world, for many the sound isn't much better than CV1, probably less bass than CV1. 

4. Comfort: Pros: Best comfort ever. Cons: May depend on the shape of your head, some feel pain after using Index for relatively short periods of time, Index is heavy - about 50 % more weight than CV1.

5. Knuckles: Pros: Full finger tracking, grip force, true 2nd gen controllers, completely new way of immersion. Cons: Way too expensive, finger tracking often doesn't work, bad design = hard to use thumb sticks and buttons, good old Touch feels much more natural, possibly bad quality = right thumb stick may not work correctly. 

6. Content: Pros: Valve is going to release 3 potentially awesome VR games and old VR games may look better than ever - also in 144 Hz, you can play Oculus exclusive titles using Revive. Cons: Revive doesn't work properly with many (most?) games, you can mostly play your old SteamVR games = lack of new Index exclusive content, content feels like old wine on a new bottle, Valve won't finish their games maybe like ever. 

If only Oculus had released a more high-end HMD we wouldn't have to go through all this trouble. Just let us upgrade only the HMD while keeping the good old sensors and Touch, sigh... 

Any users on here with the index and our Flyinside Flight Sim can test if the headset works ok under SteamVR option please :)

RuneSR2 said:

Must say that it's hard to keep up the motivation with these reviews - this is another CV1 to Index, and probably a great one, but it more or less concludes that the CV1 is nearly just as great (I've put some text in bold):

The Good, The Bad and The Ugly

Only a day of use but my first impressions are a little bittersweet, coming from the CV1 I was expecting much more, to be honest.

THE GOOD:

• Build quality is great

• The clarity increase is very noticeable; the SDE is still there and easy to see but the improvement is still big, for me the clearest upgrade of all.

• Sound is fantastic, it's great not to have anything touching your ears and the quality is really really good

• I love the design of the headset

• Very comfortable and they way you put it on is the best I've seen

• Great controllers with lots of potential for future titles. The strap is a great idea and throwing stuff in certain games is a real pleasure with them.

• 5m+1m cable is very welcome, perfect, unless you have a really big room, without any need for extensions.

• Blacks and colours were perfectly fine for me, no complains at all with the blacks in dark games

• A lot of love went into the design of every part of the HMD and it shows

THE BAD:

• The Glare is really awful, it's like a ring of light around your lenses. It doesn't happen all the time and in many games it probably won't be a problem at all but when it happens it is very immersion breaking, so far my biggest complain.

• The FOV: it's a very minor upgrade, I wasn't expecting something like the Pimax's biggest or medium FOV but at least something close to Pimax's small view. The vertical increase is nice but horizontally the difference compared to the OG Rift, for me at least and with the lenses pressed to my face, is minimal. Very disappointing considering it was one of my main reasons for buying the Index.

• SteamVR UI is terrible. You can't even change the refresh rate from inside the headset, using the desktop is a joke and some other stuff is also sub-par to say the least. Coming from Oculus Home and Dash it is a HUGE step down in functionality.

THE UGLY:

• Controllers are great as I said but not the Holy Grail either. The first time I wore the Touch controllers was an immediate "wooow!", all fingers were exactly where I wanted, ergonomics were fantastic, etc. It wasn't like this with the knuckles. The touchpad sort of ruins what could have been some perfect controllers. The joystick placement while good is not ideal and A/B buttons have a weird uncomfortable position. I know I will just get used to them in a week or two so it's not a big issue but they could have been much better. If the sticks had been placed where the trackpad is it would be the best controllers around, no contest.

  I would have preferred swappable batteries instead of rechargeable but not a big deal either.

  Also, while it's great to let go of your hands with the strap, you can't really do anything else with the controllers on, you cannot grab a beer, type or anything else. With Touch and their wrist strap on, you just let go and your hands are totally free for writing, picking up your phone, even go to the bathroom, way way more convenient than the knuckles on that respect. Overall I'd call it a draw between the Knuckles and Touch.

• The space below your nose is huge, I am surprised nobody's mentioned this but I can perfectly see the floor and walk around without even moving my headset. Not much of a problem for me as I always play in the dark and it doesn't bother me at all while playing but the light leak is there and it's very strange that no reviews or users mentioned this at all.

• Most games need to be updated, otherwise you need to reconfigure most bindings which is a bit of a pain in the ass. InDeath for instance was unplayable in the Steam version with the default controls and it happens with other games too. I couldn't click on anything on Bigscreen and the mouse icon and laser beam from the controllers were pretty far from each other not knowing which one was the 'good one' (none worked for clicking). Also sometimes you can't grab your controller and click, which is very annoying. That being said, being able to change the bindings for every game is a big plus for me and it is just a matter of spending some time changing some bindings to get everything working so it's only a minor and temporary issue but worth mentioning for those who just want to plug and play without any messing around.

• Revive: I know this is not an Index problem per se but I am really glad I have kept my Rift because I will probably end up using it for all of Oculus exclusives, or most of them at least. I need to do more testing, though. I tried The Mage's Tale and it looked and played fantastic on the Index out of the box. Arizona Sunshine looked very crisp and clear but it was unplayable (1080Ti) due to the stuttering and artifacts on screen (maximum quality with no issues on my Rift). Other games like Chronos gave me an 'entitlement check error' and others were too dark in certain areas, still playable but not ideal if you check out the same game on the Rift.

• Considering the not so big upgrades the price is way too expensive. I never thought it was that way before trying it out, I thought it was ok for a premium product but the truth is it is not so premium. It's very good, probably the best out there right now but not a 1070€ product. If the Rift S had kept the IPD adjustment and headphones it would probably be the best choice around all things considered.

This may all sound too negative but as I said it's just my impressions after one day of use. I am sure, and I hope, that the more I use it the more I'm going to like it, the product itself is great and many of the little annoyances like SteamVR UI, controller issues in certain games, etc can be fixed, so it all should be good and even better once Valve games start to come out.

That being said, I am happy I didn't sell my Rift, yesterday I was swapping both the Rift and the Index to compare games and features and in all honesty, it wasn't a big difference. The bigger clarity of the Index is there but so is the Glare on the negative side.

I don't think I will be returning it since I like to have more than one headset in case one breaks of malfunctions but for someone with a Rift I don't think I would recommend upgrading to the Index, it's way too expensive for the small upgrades it offers.

On a more postive note and considering this is Valve's first VR HMD I have to say it is a very amazing product with a lot of love put into it. Other than the Glare everything about it is top quality, just a little overpriced. Now, would I buy an Index 2 if it came out next year with a real FOV improvement and no glare? of course I would.

Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/ValveIndex/comments/c8aukr/the_good_the_bad_and_the_ugly/

Rune to most a CV1 and index are to close and similar to tell much of a difference.
Especially new folks who are just being introduced to VR.
We elitist enthusist snobs know better because well Punkies out guys we have a more refined sense of what to look for.

That being said a professional or semi-professional reviewer who wants to be taken seriously should know the F’n difference!
Other then the controllers ;which admitedly I like the Touch better; it is like comparing a 1980’s stock Camero to a present day stock Camero.
Sure they both look nice and they are both fast one obviously has better engineering.